customer looking for "hugger orange"

[gtc73]

Evening experts!

I have a customer who would like me to throw some of my flames in silver/aluminum metalic on his current HUGGER ORANGE warrior. I have a couple of challenges I want to throw out here for your input. 1st, here's the bike


The challenge is this.
He has a custom rear fender he will be sending me that I will be painting for him to match his tank and front fender which he is calling "hugger orange". He claims it is a "HOK" hugger orange paint, however I don't see it as an available color listed on the HOK website.

The other challenge is to know whether the bike is currently a single or 2 stage paint job. I'm assuming when looking at a single vs dual stage paint job it should be very obvious??? ie, base coat/clear coat should be pretty easy differentiate over single stage gloss enamel?

Here's my base plan;

1. scuff front fender and tank with eh....1500 wet sand to clean up the clear coat.
2. lay down some of my silver/aluminum 3-d flames on top of the hugger orange, then a couple/3 coats of clear.

the "challange".....if figuring out (A) where to get/match up the hugger orange and (B) confirm it's dual vs single stage.....

your input is certainly appreciate!!
g

 

[gtc73]

questions guys!

if I wet sand say with a 1500 or 2000 ( tins need to be scuffed for the flames anyway), I should think if I am dealing with a single stage hugger orange paint job, I would think I would see some orange in the water and on the tank, as apposed to WHITE CHAULKY WATER" which would indicate a separate clear coat...indicating a dual stage paint job?? make sense?

g

 

[bondofreak]

At this point it doesn't matter if it is SS enamel or base/clear. You need IMO some cushion so you don't cut through the clear or SS orange whichever it may be. I would start off by carefully scuffing it with 1000 to dull it. Bury it with 2-3 coats of urethane clear. Let cure for a few days then re-scuff. Start your graphics. Re-clear.

 

[Wydir]

wet sand an area with 2000grit if the water turns its orange its single stage if its white its base clear as far as matching the color will be a bit tricky as it could be a candy color. have you seen his bike in person? haha you replied to quick as you have solved half of you problem on your own.

 

[gtc73]

thanks so far guys.....good to see we are on the same page....
haven't seen the tins yet., they are shipping from Ohio to my shop over the next week or so.

I didn't think of building up a protective layer of clear. Absolutely can do that.

But as far as causing some kind of catastrophic chemical reaction.....if I spray a urethane clear on top of say a single stage enamel will this cause a "meltdown".......I assume spraying urethane on top of urethane (whether its single or dual stage) wont cause any major malfunctions.....but urethane on top of enamel?? is that "coscher" ??

 

[bondofreak]

I think you are confused. If not hang on....

You might be asking if the paint is 1K (unactivated/no hardeners). Meaning no hardener.

Single Stage paint is just color with no clear on top. Single Stage is one stage of application.

Two Stage is base and clear.... and that equals 2 stages. The base can be 1K or activated depending on the directions of that particular product but the clear urethane will be activated and some even reduced.

Now....The 2K term is paint/primer products that have been activated with hardener or activators. Not two stage.

1K is not activated. Is reduced (not activated) most of the time though.

1K is checked with a rag and some laquer thinner. If the color rubs off on the rag then it is most likely 1K.

If not it is 2K.

Good cured unactivated enamel (1K) can be top coated but you will be rolling the dice.

Confused yet?

Time for more study??

 

[TAZ]

Good explanation BF.

gtc...most likley that is a bc/cc, but you are right, if you wetsand and the water is orange, it's a single stage paint. If it's chalky, it's a bc/cc

But like BF siad, it really doesn't matter. All you need to do is sand it, add the flames, clearcoat it, wetsand and buff if an you are done.

This is as long as the base is absolutely perfect and that you do not go through the orange when wetsanding.

If you do have to spot some bad areas, you can just wetsand it, blend those areas, clearcoat (or reclear if it came clearcoated), resand again, and now the prepped base is the base that you painted, and not the one that came with it.

It could also be a candy type paint (tri-stage) like Wydir said, but it doesn't look like it in the picture. Hugger Orange is really a Chevy solid color. BUT they could have added some pearl in it, or over it (to make it a tri-stage paint). You really won't know until you get the bike. You can also do the lacquer thinner test like mentioned above.

 

[gtc73]

sounds good guys!
I will be referencing back to these replies when the tins arrive at my home/shop.

and yes I still don't have the warm fuzzy feeling just yet. let me explain.

I recently had an experience with a rustoleum spray bomb. I sprayed a couple of small parts with the bomb.......then ...even weeks or months later, went and tried to clear coat these pieces, and the base basically wrinkled off the piece. So that's the fear factor I have. I know, I know, your saying "dude, why would you try to clear a single stage paint right?....

Now I am assuming what I sprayed from the bomb had a chemical reaction to the clear. Also assuming I sprayed an acrylic enamel (single stage??) if I am using the term correctly. Then some time later scuffed it and tried to clear it. Thats when all hell broke loose.

So I am assuming I mixed acrylic enamel, and a urethane base product which caused the melt down???? does this make sense?
thanks/g

 

[Wydir]

spray paint is not single stage paint. spray paint is air dried product we would normally refer to it as a 1k product. A single stage paint is basically color, clear, hardener all mixed together so anything with a hardener mixed in would be a 2k product. also all products have a recoat window to be followed to prevent mishaps and or oh **** moments. as for me saying it was a candy was based on you saying it was a HOK paint job so to do a solid candy color the candy would be sprayed over a white base with a transparent orange solid candy like a KK series product no pearls or metallic.

 

[gtc73]

man I am gettin schooled here.....I'm paying close attention to this stuff so thanks very much for the replies!

spray paint is not single stage paint. spray paint is air dried product we would normally refer to it as a 1k product. A single stage paint is basically color, clear, hardener all mixed together so anything with a hardener mixed in would be a 2k product. also all products have a recoat window to be followed to prevent mishaps and or oh **** moments. as for me saying it was a candy was based on you saying it was a HOK paint job so to do a solid candy color the candy would be sprayed over a white base with a transparent orange solid candy like a KK series product no pearls or metallic.

 

[chopolds]

Hugger Orange is a 69 Camaro color, doesn't look like a HOK custom paint to me.
As for the rest, the experts have already given you good advice.

 

[gtc73]

thanks, once I get the tins in hand, I'll take one to the local paint shop to get is scoped to see about matching it up...
g

Hugger Orange is a 69 Camaro color, doesn't look like a HOK custom paint to me.
As for the rest, the experts have already given you good advice.

 

[gtc73]

ok folks, !
as luck would have it, UPS dented my customers tank in shipping. Nothing major, just the fact that it's another series of steps that was not planned for. We'll live.

Turns out, its a base coat/clear coat paint job. How ever, in order to insure a match, and given the body work that had to get done, we are going with e new base coat clear coat process. So it's all scuffed and primed and ready to shoot the new base.

I have a question about HOK Molley Orange.....there's a note in the detail description of the product that says "Due to their unique chemistry they may be top coated with either an acrylic lacquer or urethane enamel."

I have been using, and have been having great success with 5 Star Xtreme Clear coat....which is a "universal urethane" clear coat. I get "spooked" when I read acrylic lacquer or urethane enamel....do I need to fret any?

 

[bondofreak]

5 star should be ok.

 

[gtc73]

morning guys! and thanks for the schooling on the 1k, 2k, single stage and 2 stage terminology. Though I am still reading and rereading this to get my lingo straight, it is somewhat CLEARER today.....no puns intended

QUESTION;
regarding clears.......2k?? clear in a spray bomb..I have a new painter asking me a question about spraying clear from a can. His question relates to durability of the clear standing up to road rash....stone/pebble chips hitting against a chin spoiler.....

Now he intends to spray bomb his chin spoiler. Not knowing the brand, I am "assuming" it's a 2k?? and if it's a gloss finish, has the clear in it.

My question is, and I thought I read this somewhere, is does this type if paint system have any more of less durability, then say a 2 stage with 3-4 coats of a good clear on it??

thanks gang!

I think you are confused. If not hang on....

You might be asking if the paint is 1K (unactivated/no hardeners). Meaning no hardener.

Single Stage paint is just color with no clear on top. Single Stage is one stage of application.

Two Stage is base and clear.... and that equals 2 stages. The base can be 1K or activated depending on the directions of that particular product but the clear urethane will be activated and some even reduced.

Now....The 2K term is paint/primer products that have been activated with hardener or activators. Not two stage.

1K is not activated. Is reduced (not activated) most of the time though.

1K is checked with a rag and some laquer thinner. If the color rubs off on the rag then it is most likely 1K.

If not it is 2K.

Good cured unactivated enamel (1K) can be top coated but you will be rolling the dice.

Confused yet?

Time for more study??

 

[TAZ]

Spray can paint is not 2K (does not contain hardener).
Therefore it is not very durable.
There is quite a big difference of durability between a $10 can of clear and a $50 quart of clear.

 

[gtc73]

thats what I thought, thanks for the confirmation!!!!

Spray can paint is not 2K (does not contain hardener).
Therefore it is not very durable.
There is quite a big difference of durability between a $10 can of clear and a $50 quart of clear.

 

[bondofreak]

Most everything in a spray can is 1K.

There is Spraymax 2K clear in an aerosol can after activated lasts 24 hrs. Completrely different than the typical wal-mart spray bombs.

Never tried it but have seen it used. Poor mans's 2K.

http://www.repaintsupply.com/pd_2_part_2k_aerosol.cfm

Even has a video........

 

[TAZ]

Don't know if I'd call that poor man's 2k (lol) at $17+ plus the paint.
Guess it does save you from buying a gun though.

 

[bondofreak]

Ya way I see it saving on an air supply and guns not to mention hoses, fittings, filtration and inferior atomization compared to quality equipment it's pretty much poor man's stuff IMO. Looks like a high jack going on. Ha! Good stuff for somebody over in spray bomb section huh. I would hate to do an allover extended van with a spray can. Lol.