Dupont vs. PPG & HOC?

[groovesdown]

Great site you guys. All I know about painting is its cheaper to do it myself. Only done a couple of motorcycles. Put flames on my sons sporty. Have been using Dupont basemaker and chromaclear. I would like to know the pros & cons to what Im using and what you all seem to be using; PPG or HOC. Any input would be appreciated.

Groovesdown

 

[BonesFX]

All these lines of paint are similiar in the way they work. I've personally never used Dupont, but I'm sure it's as good as the rest of the big ones. I mostly use HOK's color line for bases and kandies. The pigment for their base coats covers great and nothing beats their kandies for depth. Hok was made for the custom painter by a custom painter so most of their stuff is good. I used to use HOK's clears but have switched to PPG Global clear for the high solids content and superior coverage it provides. Everyone of these companies has a good reputation with their products, so it really comes down to what you like and what you don't
Bones!~

 

[rmt1and1]

Bone's as usual seems right on the money. Most paints today, especially from the major companies are all pretty compatible, clears on the other hands in my opinion are not. In many cases Dupont may be a tad more expensive depending on the use. Dupont has been around in many areas of development for many years. Their research is second to none. They do have some superior stuff, no question about i
HOC is a custom paint company... emphasize the custom. PPG is a very popular brand in many states. Dupont is very popular in the southern parts of the US. All in all its what you like yourself, that fits within your style, use, and pocketbook. The competition is very close now in that everyone has some quality in use.
Just a comment. Don't take it to seriously.

 

[Kyle]

One thing I like about HOK is that their paints are made to go on thick, with multiple layers. PPG and Dupont make good paint, but it isn't specifically developed for thick mil graphics.

 

[Stretch]

What about functionality? I know I'm going to be painting bikes that are going to spend their time on the road, not in custom shows. Any thoughts?

Thanks-Stretch

 

[BonesFX]

Strech - the "higher" end clears are what you want to use - They're generally softer and don't chip as bad as the cheaper clears - and cover grafix alot quicker ! As with anything thats worth it, they tend to be a lot more expensive - but Like I tell my clients - why would you want a Krylon paint job on a $25,000.00 bike!! - and then just pass the cost on to them --

Bones!~

 

[groovesdown]

Thanks guys. Bones, you use HOC for everything but the clear? I been told by the guy at the paint store that when you use HOC you had to use it all through to the end and further he said that its more difficult to paint with and way more expensive than the Dupont but he does have it on his shelves. If its not that hard to use I would like to try it on a flame job I have in mind for my Ironhead. Their candys look really deep.

Groovesdown

 

[larto]

Groovesdown, actually HOK is cheaper to use than Dupont, from their sealer to their basecoats, and their clears. As far as ease of use, both lines are user friendly to someone with moderate experience (and some common sense <g>). Also, both paint lines will hold up over the long haul provided they are used correctly. Hok's kandys are definitely hard to beat for depth. As mentioned in a earlier post, HOK is designed for thicker mil. application. You can't go wrong using either line. Good luck, Larry.

 

[TWISTED]

I use whatever brand has the right color selection for a specific job.
Primers are usually sherwin Williams or HOK.
For bases I prefer HOK but I have used just about everything else on the market. I usually do a lot of graffix so the HOK is better suited for that style of paint job. I will occasionally use water based acrylics in my graffix as well.
I use the HOK clears but lately they are not as good as the old stuff. I got some clear by a company called Tech. My jobber suggested it and it is the only product in his store that he will personally refund your money if you are not satisfied with it. It seems to work good so far. Flows really good and needs very little buffing for the smooth as glass finish. It is also much cheaper. The overall clear is $109 for the clear and catalyst to make 7 qts. The spot repair is $55 for the clear and catalyst and makes five qts. As far as long term I have been told it is pretty good.Anybody else heard of the stuff?

 

[John Pierce]

Groovesdown, I've used PPG clears on top of HOK with absolutely no problems... I think the PPG clears spray better than the HOK clears, but I think the HOK clears are tougher when dry; the PPG clears seem to scratch a little easier -- just my opinion, your mileage may vary.

As far as being difficult to spray, my local PPG dealer likes to tell people HOK is difficult to spray, but I don't think it's any harder than PPG. I used to spray Dupont in the old Lacquer days with good results, but haven't used any of their urethanes.

JP

 

[BonesFX]

Grooves -- You can base and top coat with any brands, although the manufacturer's don't recomend it because they want you to use all their products from the begining til the end - It's all urethane based so as long as you don't use laquer or single stage enamels you'll be ok.

I used to use the HOK UFC-40 for all of my clearing, but HOK decided to be more VOC Compliant (or maybe the Gov. made them) None the less - They switched me to UFC-35 which I beleive has a 35% solids in it compared to the 40% in the UFC-40 -- It just didn't cover paint edges as good as the 40 and I was dissapionted with it - I talked to my PPG Jobber (whom also sells the HOK line) about it and he was explianing all the different kinds of HOK and PPG clears. He is familiar with my work and my Habits when I paint and suggested the PPG Global. It has a 50% solids content and covers extremely thick after 3 or 4 coats. It doesn't like to flow that well after that many coats, but I color sand everything and buff so that doesn't matter to me. The job I'm working on now has a total of 11 coats of various bases and kandies and SG100 in which I didn't clear between anything (except for the SG100) leaving a huge edge (this is all in a different post-"paintedge/clearing question) Anyway I shot 4 coats of Global and it covered really good - I could sand most of the "top" parts flat with 600 grit - the sides of the parts aren't as flat because of the way they where sitting when I shot the clear. So far I've been really happy with this clear - it covers quick - has the best D.O.I. because of the solids in it and sands and buffs easy - -It's also in the same price range as the HOK clears -- Bones!~

 

[John Pierce]

Bones: So the PPG GLobal clear is about the same price as UC-35? How 'bout the catalyst, is it comparable in price too? That's where I have found PPG to be a little higher.... that 50% solids action sounds great though. Also, how do you think the Global compares to the PPG 2021?

Thanks,
JP

 

[groovesdown]

Bones, sounds like I might switch to the HOC clears for my next tank and fender job. Mainly because of the intercoat clear for protection when i put on the flames and the surface clears for their durability. Are both the HOC surface clears as fuel resistance as claimed? The tanks I did with chromaclear didnt hold up well. My sons looked really good with the flames but bubbled up around the bung. I put a flatner in mine and it was cool until a mistake with a couple of drops of fuel hit it. Shredded right down to the color. Maybe I did something wrong. Both tanks had a couple of weeks curing time before use. What do ya think?

Groovesdown

 

[tcannon]

I've been more happy with the Dupont Nason 496 Select Clear than the PPG, Omni, HOK or Dupont Chroma clears. I did some testing by mixing some, covering the bottom of a soup can, letting it dry for a day, then filling the can with gasoline and left it until the gas evaporated. It didn't do a thing to the clear. My experience with gas damage around the filler has been when the paint edge is not sealed the gas will "wick" through the primer to bubble up the paint. Most of today's urethanes are great. I'd use whatever was the most convenient. Make sure whoever you get paint from has good tech support. Sometimes you might pay more but good tech support can be priceless. Enjoy!!

 

[BonesFX]

My jobber did a comparison in prices and the PPG was just a little higher and that was for a gallon of clear, 1 qt of catylst - and he gave me a qt. of reducer - you have to buy the clear and the reducer in gallons. Of course everyone has different prices and he gives me a 15% discount on anything stocked, but even if I had to pay full price I would - He actually gave me a qt of clear with reducer and catylst to try out about 1 1/2 months ago and I loved it - and it was enough for me to paint two, 4 piece bikes!! I like free stuff!! Ask your jobber to hook you up!!! Peace! -- Bones!~

 

[BonesFX]

That whole Gas Tank Filler hole that bubbles has happened to everyone and if It hasn't -- it will -- most of the problem is exactly where you cut your masking and the other would be the clients gas caps, if they leak your gonna have a mess. I use 2" tape and lay it right across the top of the filler hole and then trim around. I always ask the client for "the caps he will be using" because I can put them on and decide where I'm going to mask to. Make sure you DO NOT guarantee the paint if they switch caps. And if you want to "test" the caps and tanks they brought you, fill the tanks up half way with water and then put the cap on and flip them upside down -- if water comes out - make sure they know --- Bones!~