how do you tell the difference in enamels and acrylics? newbie

[kiwi_scott]

hi im new to this stuff and also hope im posting in the correct forum

how do you tell if the item has been painted in enamel or acrylic paint?

i have been told you cant mix the paints?

any help would be much appreciated thanks.

 

[Maylar]

Those two terms are ambiguous. Enamel can also be acrylic. Acrylic enamel, acrylic laquer, acrylic urethane are different paint types.

The only reliable way to tell is to destroy a small area. Laquer will disolve with laquer thinner, no matter how old it is. Enamel usually melts with brake fluid but it may take some time. Urethane is impervious to just about anything.

Laquers and urethanes are safe to paint over. Enamels can be funky, I've read of people having lifting problems even with fully cured enamel. There are primers however that are safe over anything. Once you have a good primer down you can use the paint of your choice. Ask the guy at the paint store.

 

[TAZ]

Welcome to the forum.

Assuming you mean acrylic enamel and an enamel, there really is no way of telling the difference that I know of.

What are you trying to accomplish? Possibly we can help

 

[kiwi_scott]

thanks for the help i am trying to do a touch up on a van it had some ugly dents iv done full resparys from primer b4 but this is much more intense and confusing. the guy at the paint shop without seeing the van has given me some paint and thinners and said i do not need a clear coat? i have not looked into this very well. also if clear coat is not needed how do i fade colours out? im stumped and this is above my knoledge .

 

[TAZ]

A few questions for you.

What brand of paint is it that they guy gave you?
What type of paint does it say it is? Acrylic lacquer, acrylic enamel?
Is it a 'thinner' he gave you or a 'reducer'?
Is the paint you will be spraying a solid color or a metallic. A solid color would be like a white, black, red, yellow

 

[kiwi_scott]

ppg dulon aaa mixed colour and came with 2way thinners i think but deff says thinners. whats the difference in reducer and thinners? its solid white colour

 

[Brian Dee]

there is a difference between reducers and thinners. but we all use thinners as a generic term. Without getting in to the chemical properties of both they both basically do the same thing but differently.if that makes any sense.

Thinners are more specific to nitrocellulose and acrylic lacquers, alkyd oil base and synthetic petroleum based paints. Petroleum based and Acrylic based chemicals do NOT intermix as they are incompatible (much like oil and water). The amount, or mixing ratios of thinners, typically up to 50% for final coating, control the spray amount and pattern through the spray gun. The amount used to thin the paint is directly related to texture, flow and drying times/temperatures. And most often discovered through trial and error, the finish achieved comes from the thinning, air pressure and gun distance performed by the painter.

Reducers act the same as thinners but the similarities end at thinning the paint into spray-able materials. Product branded reducers, normally manufactured to use exclusively for their specific brand line up, not only thin the paint, they are also available to control the paint flow by using temperature controlled chemistry for use in cold, warm and hot weather. They are designed to 'bind' at the molecular level and dilute the paint, hardener (nearly always used) and forcing it to flow, evaporate and cure all at the same rate. Today's reducers are used in base coat, clear coat, polyurethane, urethane, acrylic enamel and several primers and epoxy base/primer/top coatings. Extremely durable and very expensive...but far better with a much longer lifespan then oil based products.
In short just remember to use the correct reducer/thinner the paint manufacture recommends for the product you are using.Hope this helps.

 

[kiwi_scott]

thanks everyone been a awesome help. now wen im spraying it how do i go about it? can i fade the direct gloss paint out or will it have a dry spray look? the paint on the van is quite old and im not to sure if it will be the same colour with the new paint, i understand with base and clear i can spray over the area and fade the colour out blending it with the origonal paint then spray clear coat over the hole panel

 

[Maylar]

Do you have a part number for the paint? I don't see dulon on PPG's web site.

 

[TAZ]

I'd never heard of it either. I did do a Google search for it, and it appears to be a acrylic lacquer made by PPG.

If that van has been repainted, I would suggest getting some enamel to blend the area. Then you can either blend the clear or reclear the complete panel.

 

[Maylar]

It seems laquers are still available in NZ and Oz.. they've been banned in the States for years, that's why we've never heard of Dulon.

Laquer blends perfectly over old laquer. If the old paint comes off on a rag that's damp with laquer thinner, I'd use it. If not I'd get something else in a base/clear and do like Taz suggested.