Orange Peel Questions.

[AlxxNova]

Hi,

I'm new to painting. Actually I'm painting my first set of HD tanks and fenders now using HOK paints. The parts are new and will be painted with a black (BC-25) base. Then shimrin cinder red (FBC-11) metallic flames with gold (U-11) pin stripes, and cleared (UC-35)

I've sprayed the primer (KP-2CF) and sanded it smooth. Then the sealer (KS-11) which came out good. Then I sprayed the base coat (BC-25). Now I have orange peel on all the parts. Do I need to remove ALL traces of the orange peel. I've sanded (600 wet) one tank down some but there is still a very slight trace of orange peel left. So before I spray on the intercoat clear (SG-100) do I need to sand it down more? Should I use 400 grit instead? If the intercoat clear has orange peel do I need to sand that also? Any precautions to take to minimize the chance of orange peel?

I assume my gun isn't helping any. It's a cheap HVLP made in China (all I could afford right now). If this comes out good I'll be able to talk my other half into some better equipment. I was thinking of a DeVilbiss Finishline HVLP gravity feed model with the liners. Any pros or cons with them?

Any help at all would be really appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
Alex
Erwin, NC

 

[Motornoggin]

Alex,
Welcome aboard! It sounds to me like you have the fundamentals o.k. If your primer and sealer coats are smooth, then I would not worry too much about some peel in the base. As a matter of fact I still haven't found a base that applies absolutely smooth, kind of the nature of the material to be somewhat peely. Clear has an ability to make things smooth out pretty nicely. I try not to sand my base coats as they are not designed to be sanded before clear is applied. Some manufacturer's will allow for some minor sanding of base to touch up dust or a bug, but not anything more than that. If you want to minimize peel between color coats, I would wait until you spray the intercoat and lightly sand that. I will get rid of most of the remaining peel before my last coat of final clear and then cut and buff for a super smooth finish.

It seems that with HVLP guns it is harder to get a super smooth coat. I just plan on spending a little more time at the tail end of the project to get that glass-like sheen. After a few projects though, I have come to love my HVLP guns! They are efficient! I too have one of those Harbor Freight specials ($39.95 on sale!), I am completely amazed at the way they spray, not anything close to a pro-qaulity gun, but for the money they can't be beat! I have graduated to a DeVillebiss GTI and really like it. I use it for color coats and clear coats. However, I still use the cheap gun for my primers and sealers, if I make a mistake and let some epoxy set up in the gun I'm not out a whole lot. I sand my primer coats (not sealer coats) anyway. I'm sure some of the more experienced guys will chime in here if I have lead you wrong. Keep going, be patient and don't worry about little mistakes, they are easy to take care of on motorcycle parts!

 

[rex]

Welcome Alex.Does it look like you painted it with a roller or is it just some peel?All paint for the most part will have a touch of peel but gun setup,reducers,application and the general flowing characteristics of the material will dictate how bad it is.You can hose it on and it will lay down like glass if it doesn't run or get a 'forced peel' where it lays down and sags into peel again,but don't be tempted to do it.If you have the right reducer play with the gun to get it to break up the paint into the smallest possible drops and keep a pattern.Use a piece of masking paper on the wall.Point the gun at it at normal spraying distance.Now do exactly this-with the gun in hand and your fingers on the trigger,pull all the way back and release immediately,no air only stage on the trigger.It'll take less time than saying off-max-off.Now look at the drop sizes on the edge of the pattern.If they're huge up the pressure and/or cut back on the fluid flow.Do this until you get the smallest drops while maintaining a good even pattern.Now you have the best atomization that gun setup will give you.Another few reasons are you could be moving too fast or your reducer is too fast.It's a general misconception that if you want it to dry fast use a faster reducer.To a point this is true but.Say it's 85 degrees and one reducer is rated from 70-80 and the next is 80-90.Use the latter no matter what.The first will work and dry quick to help in dust control and you might get a little more peel but no biggie.The problem is the top is what dries so fast and it traps solvent in the coat of paint,so really it dries slower.Oooh,now we have 3 or 4 coats stacked up doing this.That's usually the reason someone complains their tape left lines taping up a 2tone or grafics even though they waited longer than the label said.There are exceptions to this but it's the general rule to go by.

Now,if you sand the color (solids only right?) before the intercoat clear you should be fine with 3M 600,the import stuff is coarser and I usually don't go below 600.If the first coat of clear goes on really peely,put on 2 but knock it down with 1000 or so to prevent your striping color from wanting to walk in the scratches.I don't stripe so I'm winging that one,but I can just see it happening with a free flowing stripe paint.Make sure you don't bust through the clear if you do have to sand it.After that's done lay the real clear to it.

 

[AlxxNova]

Thanks guys.

The orange peel varies from part to part. It is larger on the tanks and smaller on the fenders. I assume that is due to how I controled the gun since everything was done at the same time.

I double checked and definitly had the right reducer. Though it was very humid that day if that makes a difference with orange peel.

 

[rex]

Humidity does play a part in it.It tends to make it flash off quicker.Since the feel varies,pay attention to your distance from the work and your pass speed,it's one of these that's causing it.

 

[AlxxNova]

Hi Rex,

This afternoon I tried what you had suggested yesterday. Turning up the pressure helped so I cranked the pressure up to 60 psi. I still have some orange peel but it's very, very small. It should be a breeze to clean up compared to the way it was yesterday with those huge craters. Also it was a lot less humid today.

I am wondering though if I'm noticing it more because I'm spraying a solid black base. I've always been told everything shows up more with black.

There was one other thing that I am curious about. It mentions in the tech book that it is supposed to flash to a dull look. But all the parts seem glossy. Unlike the primer and sealer which definitely flashed to a dull finish.

Thanks.