Thanx EZ

rex

New member
I took your advise on clearing my parts and it worked great this time.I only had an edge from 2 coats of candy so it didn't take alot,but the extra time it took to put on an extra 2 coats of clear sure saved alot more doing the block and reclear gig a few times.Thanx again,it saves a ton of time.I'll take a pic when the rear fender is done after the artwork.
 

ezrider

New member
Rex ,no need to thank me just passing on the knowledge that took me alot of trying and a lot more errors. glad it worked out and cant wait to see the pics.
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M

Mac_Muz

Guest
Just checkin in here to say hi.... I have a few off topic questions as well....

Hint: 4x4 chevy truck and military type camp paint job..How to?

And any tips on migwelders... Seeking to purchase and learn how to..?

Should I take a hike? BTW my bike still looks great.... I am not the type that is pleased often with what I do, so that is saying something... Mac
 

ezrider

New member
Hey Mac, its been a while.Glad to hear the bikes paint is still holding up. Check out if a local high school or tech school offers any Adult education classes on welding. if you really want to learn how to nothing beats hands on training its real easy once you can get ahold of the basics. do you know any welders or body men you could hang around and watch weld and let you experiment?
 

rex

New member
Where ya been Mac?Glad the scooter is doing fine.I just got my rear fender tonight from having the artwork done so hopefully I can clear it tomarrow.Mig welding is simple like EZ said,but it takes a little practice to get it down.There's a sound to the arc and once you remember it you can adjust the wire speed with your eyes closed once you set the heat.For lighter stuff Century,lincoln and Miller make some good 110v units.I lean toward Miller for the heat range.Some of the cheaper models only give you 4 heat settings for stuff up to around 1/8 plate and it seems I'm in between settings and can only play with wire speed and the speed of the welding pass.Miller had a nice 125amp or so with a rheostat so you have infinate heat adjustment.It was a little pricey like $600 +/-.Stay away from the gasless with the flux wire,totally useless IMO.For the camo job the easiest way is just get your colors and start spraying spots in the patern you want in base and then clear the whole thing.I wouldn't tape them off though so each color feathers into the next,but you have to use low pressure and it's just my preference.Foliage pattern camo is cool too.Down here it's common to start with a green base and lay palmetto froms against it and blow a few colors around them.When you take the from off it leaves a green copy under it.Glad you popped back in.
 
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Mac_Muz

Guest
Read here more than post.....

I can arc weld and gas weld/braze... used a mig only 2 times.... buying a miller monday morning brand new.... with argon or mixed gas??? argon any way.....

What other gases are used and what are these for? Thinkin mild steel weldin only... at this point any way....

As for camo paints..... that was my real question....

Are these flat paints water sucking paints?

Do these even come from run of the mill auto paint stores?

I might like to tape off real leaves and shoot over them, and or other wise want a military look....

The truck is a working truck, and or for deep woods camping, where I want to hide the truck from theives......... so gas will be there when I return....... and maybe even the radio if I get lucky......

the heat is killin me... can't think so will leave till I have better questions..... Mac
 

rex

New member
The mig gas will be 75%argon and 25% co2 I think is the mix.If you get an aluminum spool wand to weld aluminum,I think it changes to straight argon but I'm not sure since I never did it.For the cammo job I'd forget the bc/cc since it's a working vehicle even though you can get a flat clear.I hate to say it but the spray cans are the way to go.Rustoleum or something like it holds up well but you sure don't want to remove it later for a nice paint job.If it comes out with too much gloss just dust over the top of each spot after it's covered and the dry spray will sit on top and dull it.
 
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Mac_Muz

Guest
bc/cc? clear coat might be cc, but what is bc?

I may want to re do this as standard truck again.... Sanding off camo would be hard to do? Or stripping? Why?

This will always be a working truck to me, and never a show toy...

It carries tools, and pushes snow..... I some times take it camping, which is not exactly car camping..... So it gets wacked on trees, rocks, and scraped in brush.....

In winter is gets a dose of road salt, and needs a few body panels on the box now...

I bet it needs more than I see to tell the truth, and so more parts will be bought and made..... Some body parts can be made for less than I can buy them...... The one from JC Witney for the rear box quarter is almost 40 bucks! I can cut and bend steel to fit for less than half that...... Mac
 
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Mac_Muz

Guest
Just incase you wonder why I continue to post here: Under this Topic line

1, I think I may be far from topic...

2, I hunted you both EZ and REX down to a thread

3, Scott drops by too!

4, you 3 offer great advice!

5, I don't know painting really, so I leave it to those that do to post, and you guys don't mind small doses of my questions..

I have seen how soft RUSTOLIEUM is, and have seen how long it takes to dry...well almost to dry..... The makers of that product claim up to 6 months!!!! I called them when I was doin my bike, and I called others as well...

I am surprised that you guys don't know some more car type camo paints to use frankly....

I am also pretty sure you have never done this for hire..... I mean who wants this for most bikes and cars right???

My idea is to hide a few flaws I don't care about fixing like I did on the bike....

You may not recall, I am also doing my 84 Volvo turbo basicly a side by side deal, as winter waits for no man, and both need work...

The Volvo is going to get a color change from a steel blue metal flake, to the Dodge Patroitic Bright blue...... PB#3? maybe??

The door panells and seats are goin to be removed for this....

Maybe I will attempt FLAMES in pearl ghosting.... Really light so you don't see it unless you really look hard......

I like that effect on the bike..... You don't see LIberty unless you walk on over to look hard...

It was ment that way too..... I said so at the time, but why would you recall that?

Thanx Scott fer saying BC/CC Again!!! These terms are not in daily use, and now that you said so I recall it being answered before....

May I blame it on the heat, or do I have to tell the truth? Mac
 

rex

New member
Hey Mac,no worries,I'll help you any time.Scott's been real scarce lately with the new shop and I see EZ has been quite busy by the amount of his posts lately.I can usually dig in and help but once in a while I get caught up in the work and family thing and can't get much serious time to talk.If it seems I'm being stand-offish don't take it personal.I'm in the slow season and I'm grumpy and looking for work to support the family scene.Sometimes I try to spread too far and doze off.Done it a few times here in the middle of posting.If you really need something in a hurry e-mail me and I'll get with you as soon as i check it.Please don't get the idea we're avoiding you as the perception I got from your post because that's far from the truth.I'm kind of at a loss now for your camo job though.If I knew for sure I will redo it later,I'd probably try to buy pints of DP epoxy(PPG) and a qt of hardner.That way when you decide to redo it you can sand it down and lay a coat of sealer and finish.My car has been running around for over 5yrs (please don't ask) in black DP and held up good.In your environment I'd lay down 2 full coats of green,then dable in some grey,black,white,and tint the red more earthly.Of course this will cost more than a few cans of Duplicolor or even Krylon,but the protection is 100% better with the DP,along with being a flat gloss.The downside is it will wear away with time.My 2 coats of straight black(unreduced) has worn down to the primer surfacer in 4 years just from the everyday sandblasting it gets from driving 30 miles a day.The good side is I can sand the car in short time and seal and paint it if I wanted to.Don't be scarce man
cheers.gif


Oh,you're gonna love the Miller,even their cheap machines are better than a Lincolon or Century(and Century makes alot under other names like Mac Tools and older SnapOn's).Excellent choice,you'll be happy with it for sure.I usually run my bottle presure around 27-28lbs but she'll still run decent at 35 or so if the breeze picks up.If that doesn't smooth it out you have to wait for the wind to die out.You'll know because the weld spatters and gets porous as it cools.Let us know if you need a hand any time,again.
 

ezrider

New member
Mac, sorry i havent replyed i have been batteling a wickid case of Heat Stroke. if Camo is the way you want to go i would use Tintable primer sealers, i think they will hold up to the elements for a while. When custom led sleds are built they are usally sealed and driven for a while to see if there is any problems with body work cracking.hope this helps.
 

rex

New member
The reason I say it'll be hard to strip is if you use something like Rustoleum it stays kind of soft like lacquer and really gums up the paper if you try to sand it off.Haven't tried stripper but I rarely touch stripper to a car or truck.
 
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Mac_Muz

Guest
Geesh Rex!! In no way did I mean to imply anyone was avoiding me.....

I am a bit fear full about asking camo questions on a painting flames board thats all.

I worried that I may be off topic to far.

I am tired and the heat here has been killing me. The hot muggies do me in daily. The weather has just since last night turned for a better cooler drier type, so maybe I can begin to think....

I am sorry you read into what I never intended, and re read my bit and don't see what you saw.... and EZ seems to see it too, so some where I wrote something wrong... way wrong.... I am sorry on both accounts... I don't know what you see that implies that... and I never thought for a second anyone was passing off on my questions...

What I did think that it is pretty likely none of you have ever had any need to do a camo paint job...... So you might not be comfortable answering some of those questions.

I only see a few camo paints jobs that are not true military around here, and some are better than others... I have seen a few pick ups and a few jeeps, but mostly I see small boats, and most of those are canoes...... Each one seems different and some are better paint jobs than others.

I feel bad that I caused you this feeling.....

I have also been battling pain as I have re-injured an old back injury recently, but I did not think that it showed in writting style, but maybe it did... I know the combination of heat, humidity and pain are hard on my wife, but she knows me well, and she knows my shortness is cause by those things.

I am sorry......

Back to better things... The Miller is Millermatic 135/175 and M-10 Gun! I bought a instant black hemet with it, and odds and ends. Pliers to change the tips and more tips, and some greasy looking felt cleaners that seem to go on the wire.

I did not understand the salesman all that well, so am not sure where those cleaner felts are to be installed.

Also I bought some greenish blue tip dip stuff. The salesman said get the tip hot and dip it in this stuff to help clean the tip better.

He did not say how often to dip into the stuff though, and when to clean the tip.

I attempt to keep tools looking newish, so you might say what to do, if you have the time..

All my welding will be done out doors, on the grass...... Unless I can get more money fast!

The welder kinda wacked my budget harder than I at first thought it would.

My next pay will need to get parts coming for both the car and the truck, and that pay will be gone!

next pay check might buy 4 to 5 sheets of ply wood for a make shift floor that would more or less fit a tent (car port from harbor freight) with side tarps......

Winter is coming and I must beat winter....

I was going to do this work right after the bike, but a guy called with a job offer, and I took it for faster cash turn over, at a lesser rate of pay....

I make silver jewelry for the years 1700-1840, and get better money, but not weekly pay...

I am allowed to take and make my own hours at where I work... I travel 64 miles a day shortest round trip... If I stay there in winter I will have to take a different road and go farther each way.... I travel back mountain roads now...

Thats why I am so tired... trying to work on wooden boats as a wood worker, electrician, and engine tech (currently re-building a Chrystler 331 hemi from 1956), and keep up with silver orders for Renaissance which is new to me..... AAAAHHHHHH I am whining now!!!

I still have yet to flip the switch on for the welder... First project will be a ammo box as a toolbox on a boat trailer..... My trailer which does double duty as a utility trailer... I altered a boat trailer for a boat other than mine, to fit my boat, and to haul other things with out the boat.

So a box welded on seems about right as a trying out the welder to me...

I got 2 broken trailer jacks and made 1 from the both of them, but when I bolted the jack on I found it does not go low down enough to drain the boat and or fit the ball on my car.

I had the entire jack apart and do not see any way to make it go lower, so I will bolt it on the box side as a way to lower the trailer a few more inches ..... That outta do it.....And give me storage for a few tools, and tie downs...

I am sure this welding won't be the best, and I will be pushing .023 wire pretty hard...

If it fails, it is no big deal there is a ARC welder at work.

Well this little missive is getting to be a book.... I better git anyway.......

Thanks again for everything, and sorry about what has to be a mixup I started..... Mac
 

rex

New member
Hey budy,no need to appologize,from what I understand you guys have been slammed worse than us and I'm a cranky SOB.I must say thanx though,you might have beat me for the longest post on that one
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I hope the aches and pains go away though,I'm 38 and they're starting to take hold.If I don't get out of the collision end of the buisness soon I'll be screwed.I kind of know what you mean about the hassle of being so diversified on the income,it's a friggin nitemare.Take care of that back though,that really scares me if you're a physical kind of person.Oh,don't worry about off the wall questions.While the cammo thing is specialized,you never know until you ask.If we don't know at least you'll get opinions and suggestions to work off of if we don't have personal experience.You know the saying,'the only dumb question is the one that isn't asked',and Lord knows I still haven't totally comprehended it.

Ok,enough sentimental crap.Nice welder you got fer sure.The felt wad for the wire should have a can of oil for it.What you do is slide it over the wire inside the machine between the wire spool and the tube that feeds the wire into the drive rollers.Saturate the felt with the lube and it helps prevent rust and lubes the wire to glide through the wand liner better.The jar of dip is to prevent weldspatter from building up inside the outer nozzle.Sometimes it builds enough to limit gas flow or can build enough to bridge between the nozzle and tip and cause a ground out.You'll know the latter because the nozzle will spark or ark and stick to anything it touches.What you do is weld a litle until the nozzle is hot.Doesn't take long and a quick finger slap will tell you.Push the nozzle straight down into the jar and it'll coat the inside to prevent spatter from sticking.When you pull it out stop and let it drip off the excess.I personally hate the stuff because the next little bit of welding spatters alot,you'll see.They make a spraycan of the stuff that's much better but I've gotten to the point I use none of it.When the spatter builds up I remove the nozzle and the spatter flakes out with one of those pocket screwdrivers or a scribe.If you're welding pure ground and clean steel it takes a long time to build up,but if you have paint,rust,weld through primer,anything but pure steel it'll build up faster.Let me know if you have any probs getting set up.It's something hard to describe without being there but there's a sound and characteristic to the puddle that is easy to adjust when you get it.Once I get a new pic place it'll be easier to show you what it should look like than describe it.Wind is taboo though.A few MPH can be compensated for with another 10lbs of bottle pressure,but not much..The sheilding gas gets blown away easy and the weld spatters like crazy and gets porous,impurities like paint and rust do the same.If it's bad enough when you let off the trigger you'll see a hollow tit grow out at you.Stop there and correct the cause because the weld is low in strength.023 wire isn't bad for automotive sized stuff like sheetmetal.If you plan on working with 1/16" plate and larger go to .030.I do run .023 at work and have welded 1/8" and thicker stuff with it,you just go slower or make multiple passes.Hey,once again,no worries on the misunderstanding.Gotta go for now,I think the better half is getting naked
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It's been a while if you know what I mean
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Talk to you later.
 
K

kustom paint workz

Guest
mac i used to work in an auto parts store an i remember them carrying some spray bombs of camo paint colors designed for just what you want i used them on my suzuki samurai (woods beater) and it actually held up great i'm really not fond of using spray bomb for anything but it did work great for the camo. i'll get you the company name and part numbers and let you know. I think the company was sperex/vht. as for doing the camo i used basically the same method you were talking about just lay down a base color i used green first and then grabbed some leaves and held them against the truckand sprayed over them. i even used a whole tree branch and covered it with a bunch of colors it turned out pretty well. as for the welders i don't know nuuch about brands but i use a lincoln weld pak 100 for sheet metal and mild steel. i think its a pretty good unit although i think its miller with the adjustable heat knob and if you get one of them you have greater control. hope i've helped a little
 
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Mac_Muz

Guest
kustom paint workz, I will be interested in the paint... And where you got it.... I found I can get Rustolium in other than rattle cans for the camo job, but another type might work out better, or maybe less dough....

Dough really counts this time, as my car is getting a paint job and body parts too, but will look like a normal car when done....

But the double whammi with winter settin in will create some long hours with no pay...

Rex, I seem to be coming aound back wise, still stiff but that is pretty normal for folks with herniated and shattered disks..... Active and 50 yup! You betcha!

I hunt people in 1758, hunt animals for the table, fish, hike these mountains when I get time, and go canoein, and hope to go sailin my dory next spring and hence...

The dory has a suit of sails and mast that are a wicked pain on trailering... If I was filthy rich I would put it on a mooring....But since I ain't... (poor me) I want the next best thing and will rig it as "Spritsail" with a running bow sprit, and cutter rig the bow with 2 jibs... And Oh did I mention a 1750 circa swivel gun to weight not more than 40 lbs, with a golf ball size bore?

There are some including my lovin wife that think of me as some sort of a character, and i do get called a few names fer it!

Still have not plugged in that welder.. I got one of those instant black masks, so I want to try it in day light the first time.... If I wanted to weld at night my old arc mask would have been fine......right? Mac
 

rex

New member
Glad to hearyou're feeling better.I can't believe you do what you do by the sounds of it.The auto helmets are great.The arc welding helmet might be a touch dark,but.Usually migs are fine with a #10 or 11 shade but arcs usually run darker like 12 or 13,they have a really intense arc and will burn your eyes much faster.If the eyes have become sensitive over time like mine the darker the better.I've burned mine a few times from being in those wierd positions stuffed up in a tight spot where you cant fit a helmet,you cant hold a shield,and the arc flashes off a surrounding piece before the eyelids shut (but it will penetrate your eyelids if exposed long enough).I can use a 10 for a bit but lots of welding I need an 11.I'm not much into boats but it sounds like you have a pretty nice ride there.Take care,I'm falling asleep.
 
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Mac_Muz

Guest
Rex, I wasn't weldin, but I know about those positions pretty good.... Try this one!

lay down in the bottom of a boat with yer face about 2" from the rear carb at full tilt and setting the high speed jets....

The boat is hitting waves you can't see, and the bolts that hold the chine rails are sticking in yer back... That and the frames are the only thing keeping you off the floor itself.... That was me yesterday....

When I returned to the shop the guys were joking about the "Nice Boat Ride" I went on...

You feel the heat, .... Oh did I mention your hip ride right on the exhaust pipe? The engine is screaming i Yer face, and you are supposed to make it run better, while holding on to nothing..... I gotta get my head examined one of these days...... :) Mac
 

rex

New member
Naw you don't need your head examined.it's what you do fer love.BUT,do we do this sadomasochistic stuff when the ol' lady says 'whip me,beat me and tie me up or can I do it to you'?I think about it for1/10 of a second and say no,but I'll be darned if we don't let our toys beat the he!! out of us eh?The joys of the warped male mind are great.Take care of that back buddy
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